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Rolly
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 6:23 am    Post subject: Jump Putts? Reply with quote

Is there any new rule changes that effect jump puts? Some lame calls out there last weekend had me wondering...
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Thumber
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 7:07 am    Post subject: Re: Jump Putts? Reply with quote

Rolly wrote:
Is there any new rule changes that effect jump puts? Some lame calls out there last weekend had me wondering...


no changes...jump putting is still illegal
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surge
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 8:16 am    Post subject: Re: Jump Putts? Reply with quote

Rolly wrote:
Is there any new rule changes that effect jump puts? Some lame calls out there last weekend had me wondering...


Someone call you on a jump putt?
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surge
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 8:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

...or was it Jumping Don Splash. big grin
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Thumber
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 9:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

putt jumps are still allowed though
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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 9:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
A. When the disc is released, a player must:
(1) Have at least one supporting point that is in contact with the playing surface on the line of play and within 30 centimeters directly behind the marker disc (except as specified in 803.04 E); and,
(2) have no supporting point contact with the marker disc or any object closer to the hole than the rear edge of the marker disc; and,
(3) have all of his or her supporting points in-bounds.


If you release the disc while you are in the air, you have not followed the above rule. That's what you and Don did. You can argue and call it lame, but you were clearly in the air when you released the disc.
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Thumber
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 9:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jefrey A. Brother wrote:
Quote:
A. When the disc is released, a player must:
(1) Have at least one supporting point that is in contact with the playing surface on the line of play and within 30 centimeters directly behind the marker disc (except as specified in 803.04 E); and,
(2) have no supporting point contact with the marker disc or any object closer to the hole than the rear edge of the marker disc; and,
(3) have all of his or her supporting points in-bounds.


If you release the disc while you are in the air, you have not followed the above rule. That's what you and Don did. You can argue and call it lame, but you were clearly in the air when you released the disc.


Yep that is illegal and has been critiqued to death on the pdga board. Its the reason they are discussing eliminating the putt jump. Even Feldburg's step putt is so close that it is tough to say if it is legal
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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 9:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is what you did...


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 9:40 am    Post subject: Re: Jump Putts? Reply with quote

Rolly wrote:
Is there any new rule changes that effect jump puts? Some lame calls out there last weekend had me wondering...


And this ladies and gentlemen is what happens when someone calls someone else on the rules of the game.
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surge
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 9:48 am    Post subject: Re: Jump Putts? Reply with quote

Jefrey A. Brother wrote:
Rolly wrote:
Is there any new rule changes that effect jump puts? Some lame calls out there last weekend had me wondering...


And this ladies and gentlemen is what happens when someone calls someone else on the rules of the game.


...and this: http://www.odgc.ca/forums/viewtopic.php?t=7721 is what happens if you don't.
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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 9:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Damned if you do...
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Thumber
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 9:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Its hard in that our sport doesn't have an official to watch over the cards while playing, thus forcing players to enforce rules.
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Holly D
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think we all need to remember this:

The people on your card don't call your illegal play because they want to fuck up your game. They call you out because you broke the rules.



Except Atos. He's trying to fuck up your game. Razz
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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was the only one that was watching. Hence, there were no strokes doled out.
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burjwahzeh
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thumber wrote:
Its hard in that our sport doesn't have an official to watch over the cards while playing, thus forcing players to enforce rules.

Yes, it does. PDGA events require a rules official be present, officials may play, and playing officials can't make calls in their own divisions.
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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

burjwahzeh wrote:
Thumber wrote:
Its hard in that our sport doesn't have an official to watch over the cards while playing, thus forcing players to enforce rules.

Yes, it does. PDGA events require a rules official be present, officials may play, and playing officials can't make calls in their own divisions.


I'm a PDGA official. I can still call rule infractions. I just can't be an "official" in my divsion.
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burjwahzeh
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What sucks are the "2 or more witnesses" limitations.

Like the fact that before someone throws, I need to nudge the other guy on my card and tell him to watch his feet.
This sucks because people can't call themselves on a foot fault.

Or before suspect jump putters putt. This sucks because they'll never admit that their putt was bogus. I've called jump putts at least four times, and had to deal with whining from the jump putter, and nobody else on the card that wanted to admit they were watching.
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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 11:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don made two jump putts on Saturday. One was perfectly legal. And I think it was even more successful than his not so legal one.
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burjwahzeh
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 11:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thumber wrote:
... Even Feldburg's step putt is so close that it is tough to say if it is legal
Feldburg's putt is a stretch, yes, but it's legal... when he does it. It's technique at the limits of compliance. It's like a falling putt, but he only does it outside of 10m.

A good number of people trying to emulate that will f#ck it up.

They f#ck up jump putts, and that's supposed to be easy.
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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 11:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In a somewhat recent heated discussion on calling foot faults, I was called out about NOT calling foot faults. I mistakenly stated that there are no rules that state that I must enforce the rules. I stand corrected. The PDGA Competition Manual, under 3.3 Player Misconduct states:


Quote:
3.3 Player Misconduct
A. The PDGA adopts a strict policy of appropriate behavior and comments to the media. Any conduct deemed to be unprofessional is subject to disqualification by the Tournament Director, and may also be subject to further disciplinary actions from the PDGA.

B. Players are expected to behave in a professional and sportsmanlike manner while participating in a PDGA sanctioned event. Actions that are in violation of this conduct include but are not limited to:

(1) Repeated and overt use of abusive or profane language

(2) Throwing items in anger (other than discs in play)

(3) Overt rudeness to anyone present

(4) Willful and overt destruction, abuse or vandalism of property, including animal and plant life

(5) Cheating: a willful attempt to circumvent the rules of play

(6) Physical attacks or threatening behavior to anyone present

(7) Activities which are in violation of Federal, State or Local laws or ordinances, park regulation or disc golf course rule. Directors are granted the discretion to disqualify a player based on the severity of the offending conduct. An official warning of disqualification may be issued by a director where appropriate.

(Cool The possession of illegal substances in violation of Federal, State or Local laws.

(9) Excessive use of alcohol at the tournament site.

(10) Possession of alcohol from the start of play until the player's scorecard is submitted. Such possession shall result in immediate disqualification at PDGA events sanctioned at B-Tier or higher. The Tournament Director may, at his sole discretion, elect to issue a warning to the offending player in lieu of disqualification solely at PDGA events sanctioned at C-tier and below. If a player has been previously issued a warning for alcohol possession at the same event, all subsequent violations shall result in immediate disqualification.

(11) Overt failure or refusal to enforce the rules of disc golf during competition.

(12) Failure or refusal to cooperate with, or obstruction of any investigation by an official into the competitor's conduct or the conduct of another competitors.

(13) Deliberately seeking to manipulate ones player rating through intentional misplay or withdrawal.

C. Tournament Directors are required to report any disqualifications to the PDGA as quickly as possible.

D. Disqualified players shall forfeit any prize money or merchandise and shall not receive a refund of entry fees.

E. Players who commit Player Misconduct may also be subject to disciplinary actions. To find out more information about the Disciplinary Process please visit www.pdga.com/discipline.




This is for PDGA events. We, as a community, ignore some of these at our local and friendly events (9 and 10 come to me quickly), but at PDGA events we are aware and follow them. One more rule for you know.
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