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Do you practice hitting your mark (30 cm directly behind your lie)?
Yes
28%
 28%  [ 4 ]
No
71%
 71%  [ 10 ]
Total Votes : 14

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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 30, 2010 4:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thumber wrote:
I also disagree with both you BBP and DR Strange up there that most people are missing their marks almost every time...once or twice a round maybe, but not 100% of the time. That is simply false.


I don't think I ever stated that players are missing their mark 100% of the time. But if I did please point it out to me and I'll set matters straight. But I would hold firm that if driving from the fairway, more often than not, players are missing their marks (especially, if following the rule to the word). And most of what I've witnessed year, players are doing it to the right and left of the disc.

And "Dr. Strange" is the one who was pushing for the 60 cm circle you liked:

Quote:
9/14: Though we won't be proposing any changes to the stance rules for the 2011
revision, Dr Rick Voakes has been thinking hard about a solution. Here is a recent
note of his with a proposed remedy:

----
Peter had recommended that we not allow follow through after
passing a mark in the fairway that is 40 m from the basket. I would
change this to 30 m, since that is very close to 100 feet (97.5 ft),
so a relatively easy distance to learn to estimate for casual play. I
feel this is plenty of distance to discourage jump putts. And it would
be quicker for TD's to measure.

I would also leave a default, that if no mark is provided, then you
are allowed to have falling putts at any distance (an option we had
already considered anyway). It would not take much for a TD to step
off the distance and poke a flag into the ground on courses where
there is not a permanent marker. If this catches on, most heavily used
courses would probably cement a post into the ground at the edge of
the fairway. Or better yet, plant a stone or cinder block on the line
of play 30 m from the most common pin placement. Most tournaments move
the pins, so flags would still be needed for most tournaments.

I believe this proposal can also solve the problem of players missing
the lie with their plant foot. I had previously proposed enlarging the
"stance zone" to a 60 cm diameter circle. This would be much easier to
hit on a run-up, but might be too large a leeway when you are close to
the basket, and you could get an advantage by stretching an extra 30
cm to the side to get around an obstacle. If we use the 30 m mark for
a "no follow through" line, we could also use it for a "no 60 cm
stance zone" line. Beyond that line, the player would take a stance on
the line of play, as we do (or vaguely attempt to do) now.

I know this proposal sounds a bit radical, but we are definitely going
to have to make a major change in order to solve the stance issue. As
we now play, a very large percentage of even the top pros foot-fault
on almost every shot. If we were to drop the warning for foot-fault,
it would be a disaster. If we do nothing, the sport will start to lose
credibility in the sports world, as more media and photo coverage will
illustrate the laxity of our rules.

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surge
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 30, 2010 9:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was out practising before LNF and checked to see if I was hitting my mark consistently. I spent the rest of the day practising just that Embarassed
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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 30, 2010 9:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

surge wrote:
I was out practising before LNF and checked to see if I was hitting my mark consistently. I spent the rest of the day practising just that Embarassed


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st-ACE
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 01, 2010 12:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't practice it as in a drill. but I do take care to note whether my foot is behind my disc.
It's kind of like on a pool table where people move it in off of the bank. not cool.
I especially try to take extra care in situtaions where Im trying to stretch myself out of the woods.
In these cases, I worry that as i throw, my back leg (the one that is supposed to be behind the disc) may come up. I think I do a pretty good job of keeping it down.
it is in that particular circumstance that Im think about my mark the most.
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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 01, 2010 1:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

st-ACE wrote:
In these cases, I worry that as i throw, my back leg (the one that is supposed to be behind the disc) may come up.


Another popular move among our peers. Most golfers in Ottawa are good at this particular shot as a lot of our golfers have come from ultimate.
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Mike McCormick
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 1:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a question based on this:

(1) Have at least one supporting point that is in contact with the playing surface on the line of play and within 30 centimeters directly behind the marker disc

Is the line of play an imaginary line running through the center of the marker or is it the width of the marker?
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Thumber
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 2:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike McCormick wrote:
I have a question based on this:

(1) Have at least one supporting point that is in contact with the playing surface on the line of play and within 30 centimeters directly behind the marker disc

Is the line of play an imaginary line running through the center of the marker or is it the width of the marker?


Imaginary line of no width
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Jefrey A. Brother
King Jefrey


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 5:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike McCormick wrote:
I have a question based on this:

(1) Have at least one supporting point that is in contact with the playing surface on the line of play and within 30 centimeters directly behind the marker disc

Is the line of play an imaginary line running through the center of the marker or is it the width of the marker?



Quote:
Line of Play: The imaginary line on the playing surface extending from the center of the target through the center of the marker disc and beyond. This line has no thickness; therefore one support point must be directly behind the center of the marker.

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Rolly
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 10:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow thats a thin line,
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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 11:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rolly wrote:
Wow thats a thin line,


Nice one.

So true though.

Make this change and we're golden (well not golden, maybe bronzen):

Quote:
Line of Play: The imaginary line on the playing surface extending from the center of the target through the center of the marker disc and beyond. This line has the thickness of the marker disc being used; therefore one support point must be directly behind, and between the outside edges the of the marker.

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Mike McCormick
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 12:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jefrey A. Brother wrote:

Make this change and we're golden (well not golden, maybe bronzen):

Quote:
Line of Play: The imaginary line on the playing surface extending from the center of the target through the center of the marker disc and beyond. This line has the thickness of the marker disc being used; therefore one support point must be directly behind, and between the outside edges the of the marker.



I must be ahead of the times, that is the way I play it now Embarassed
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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 1:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike McCormick wrote:
Jefrey A. Brother wrote:

Make this change and we're golden (well not golden, maybe bronzen):

Quote:
Line of Play: The imaginary line on the playing surface extending from the center of the target through the center of the marker disc and beyond. This line has the thickness of the marker disc being used; therefore one support point must be directly behind, and between the outside edges the of the marker.



I must be ahead of the times, that is the way I play it now Embarassed


Nobody would call you if you had your foot behind the disc.
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Captain Crunch
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 24, 2010 1:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jefrey A. Brother wrote:
Thumber wrote:
This is kind of a dumb poll BBP. You may be the only person I know who practices hitting their mark. That doesn't change anything with respect to my conjecture that players in Ottawa are conscientious of trying to hit their mark. Most of us just aren't as obsessive when it comes to our play as you. The results certainly showed this year and good on ya, but a better poll would have been "Do you worry about hitting your mark"


Then I'm the only one you know who is worried about playing within the rules of the game.

And I don't consider it obsessive that if the rule states; "When the disc is released, a player must: (1) Have at least one supporting point that is in contact with the playing surface on the line of play and within 30 centimeters directly behind the marker disc."

This is a rule of the game. And I'm practicing to play within the rules. And freakin right "good on" me. I ignored others' foot faults from the fairway all year and worked on hitting mine and still found success.

This speaks volumes to the amount of respect players have of the rules and playing within them. You're right, nobody cares. This attitude is the bain of our sport.


I consider the fact that you ignored others foot faults very disrespectful of the game we all love. If you see someone breaking the rules then call them on it. Maybe they don't know of the rule or don't realize they are breaking it, but ignoring it makes you just as wrong as they are.
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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 24, 2010 2:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Captain Crunch wrote:

I consider the fact that you ignored others foot faults very disrespectful of the game we all love... but ignoring it makes you just as wrong as they are.


What a load of crap. Way to take the onus off the player who is playing and put it on the observers. If players made a commitment to follow the rules others wouldn't have to police them.
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Captain Crunch
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 24, 2010 2:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jefrey A. Brother wrote:
Captain Crunch wrote:

I consider the fact that you ignored others foot faults very disrespectful of the game we all love... but ignoring it makes you just as wrong as they are.


What a load of crap. Way to take the onus off the player who is playing and put it on the observers. If players made a commitment to follow the rules others wouldn't have to police them.


And that is a truly poor attitude towards the game on an issue that is very difficult to police yourself. Are you looking at your feet when you throw?
Everyone needs to know the rules and call them including you.
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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 24, 2010 2:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Captain Crunch wrote:
Jefrey A. Brother wrote:
Captain Crunch wrote:

I consider the fact that you ignored others foot faults very disrespectful of the game we all love... but ignoring it makes you just as wrong as they are.


What a load of crap. Way to take the onus off the player who is playing and put it on the observers. If players made a commitment to follow the rules others wouldn't have to police them.


And that is a truly poor attitude towards the game on an issue that is very difficult to police yourself. Are you looking at your feet when you throw?
Everyone needs to know the rules and call them including you.


Check out the title of the topic of the thread: "Do you practice hitting your mark in run up throws?" This thread was set up to just point out that most players, and I'll make an assumption that you fall into this category, don't practice hitting their mark when "practicing" throwing. If players actually did spend time practicing following the rules then this conversation needn't happen. Using the excuse that you don't look at your feet when you throw is weak. But yes, I do look at my feet. I look at them in the field and on the course. I take pride in my ability to hit my mark on a fairway drive.

I don't know you, and I'll go under another assumption that you don't know me. I have spent many seasons trying to get players in the Ottawa area to know the rules and to follow them. Your assumptions on my attitude and respect toward this game are way off. If you would like to discuss the role of the "Enabler" then I encourage you to chime in with your ideas in this thread.

I am not the disrespectful one because I am done with policing players who don't want to play within the rules. I accept apologies via the PM.
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Captain Crunch
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 24, 2010 4:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jefrey A. Brother wrote:
Captain Crunch wrote:
Jefrey A. Brother wrote:
Captain Crunch wrote:

I consider the fact that you ignored others foot faults very disrespectful of the game we all love... but ignoring it makes you just as wrong as they are.


What a load of crap. Way to take the onus off the player who is playing and put it on the observers. If players made a commitment to follow the rules others wouldn't have to police them.


And that is a truly poor attitude towards the game on an issue that is very difficult to police yourself. Are you looking at your feet when you throw?
Everyone needs to know the rules and call them including you.


Check out the title of the topic of the thread: "Do you practice hitting your mark in run up throws?" This thread was set up to just point out that most players, and I'll make an assumption that you fall into this category, don't practice hitting their mark when "practicing" throwing. If players actually did spend time practicing following the rules then this conversation needn't happen. Using the excuse that you don't look at your feet when you throw is weak. But yes, I do look at my feet. I look at them in the field and on the course. I take pride in my ability to hit my mark on a fairway drive.

I don't know you, and I'll go under another assumption that you don't know me. I have spent many seasons trying to get players in the Ottawa area to know the rules and to follow them. Your assumptions on my attitude and respect toward this game are way off. If you would like to discuss the role of the "Enabler" then I encourage you to chime in with your ideas in this thread.

I am not the disrespectful one because I am done with policing players who don't want to play within the rules. I accept apologies via the PM.


First off you won't get an apology from me. Secondly, it doesn't matter if I know you and you know me. That has nothing to do with the rule or discussion. Thirdly, we all play by the rules wherever I play and call foot faults on a regular basis. No, I have not been called on one. No, I do not practice it. Finally, this rule must be policed as it must be seconded by a player or official to be held up. So, the only way that you can call a foot fault is for someone else to call it.

You might also like to read PDGA Rules 801.01 A

. Players should not throw until they are certain that the thrown disc will not distract another player or potentially injure anyone present. Players should watch the other members of their group throw in order to aid in locating errant throws and to ensure compliance with the rules.

So, it seems if you are seeing them and not calling them you might be up for a courtesy warning.


You seem to pretty gung ho about everyone following the rules and yet are not willing to help others learn the rules. Seems a strange paradox.
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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 25, 2010 10:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Captain Crunch wrote:


You might also like to read PDGA Rules 801.01 A

. Players should not throw until they are certain that the thrown disc will not distract another player or potentially injure anyone present. Players should watch the other members of their group throw in order to aid in locating errant throws and to ensure compliance with the rules.

So, it seems if you are seeing them and not calling them you might be up for a courtesy warning.


You seem to pretty gung ho about everyone following the rules and yet are not willing to help others learn the rules. Seems a strange paradox.


You're so right. I should be watching the other players on my card when they throw. In fact, I do. I do a pretty good job at finding "almost-lost" discs when others have thrown one into the muck. I can usually find mine, so I'm watching mine too. I also am ensuring compliance with the rules. If you pull out an Aerobie Pro Ring, I'd be saying something to you. If I think you are cheating, then I'm calling you on itÖwith the exception of a foot fault. I havenít called one in years. I have in the past, but it's never done anything good for me, so I've stopped.

Now, I did a quick read through of the rules--and if I'm wrong I'm sure you'll point it out to me and the others reading this tangent--and I can't see any rules that state that I must call infractions on others.

There was a few times this past season that I played on a card with a "newbie" (TOSS, The GOAT, Falling Colours) and I think I did a great job explaining the rules of the game as we played our round. Your accusation of "not willing to help others learn the rules" has no backing. It's a lie.

Most of my rounds this year took place on cards with players in the HIGHEST division. The highest division of any sport would demand a full understanding of the rules. In disc golf there seems to be a soft spot for those who ďdonít know the rulesĒ, but I still EXPECT disc golfers entered in the highest division available to them to know the rules. And most of them do.

So why should I have to police them? Donít they know the rules? This is my point. The rationale behind this thread was to point out that players donít practice throwing hitting a mark, when the whole point of the game is to do that. Itís mind boggling to me.

Captain, you like rules. This is the first rule in the PDGA Official Rules of Disc Golf that deals with the fundamentals for ďthe game we loveĒ; Rules of Play

Quote:
803.01 General
A. Description of the Game. The game of disc golf consists of throwing a flying disc from the teeing area to a target by a throw or successive throws. Players shall play the course as they find it and play the disc where it lies unless allowed otherwise by the Rules. The competitor who plays the stipulated round or rounds in the fewest throws plus penalty throws is the winner.


Itís the first rule. You. Shall. Play. The. Disc. Where. It. Lies. If you picked up the book and did a 10 second read of the first page of the Rules of Play, youíd KNOW that you have to have your freakin foot behind your disc. I know itís hard. Thatís why I practice doing it. Some players donít run up and have practiced standing drives. I would like players to learn the game within the rules.

If you think that my not calling foot faults ďmakes you (me) just as wrong asĒ someone who is not following the rules that are laid out on the first page, the first paragraph, of the Rules of Play, we have different values and Iím OK with that.

There has already been a thread dedicated to The Enabler, and funny enough I started it up. If you want to have more discussions at that topic I encourage you keep it going there.
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Captain Crunch
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 25, 2010 10:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Merry Christmas.
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Rolly
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 26, 2010 5:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow, Love to be on a card with these 2 Razz
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