Ottawa Disc Golf Club

Reply to topic ODGC Forums Forum Index -> Disc Golf Rules & Course Safety -> Unplayable lie to the extreme Goto page 1, 2  Next
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
andros
ODGC Presidents Cup Champion


Joined: 10 Oct 2006
Posts: 8365
Location: Ottawa

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 10:55 am    Post subject: Unplayable lie to the extreme Reply with quote

Check out this crazy lie on DGCR;

http://www.dgcoursereview.com/forums/showthread.php?t=75745
_________________
Hyzer enthusiast
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Rolly
King of Commentary


Joined: 11 Oct 2005
Posts: 9817
Location: South East Division

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 10:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

that's playable
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
andros
ODGC Presidents Cup Champion


Joined: 10 Oct 2006
Posts: 8365
Location: Ottawa

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 11:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rolly wrote:
that's playable


Why play from there though?

Just take a re-throw.
_________________
Hyzer enthusiast
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
kenmlittle
Disc Jockey


Joined: 12 Jan 2012
Posts: 725
Location: Toronto, ON

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 11:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why wouldn't you just play directly above the lie? I thought that was the intention of the rule. Same thing if you are under a bridge but not OB, you can just play on top of the bridge.
_________________
"Friends don't let friends putt like Ken Little."
-Ken Little
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
andros
ODGC Presidents Cup Champion


Joined: 10 Oct 2006
Posts: 8365
Location: Ottawa

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 2:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kenmlittle wrote:
Why wouldn't you just play directly above the lie? I thought that was the intention of the rule. Same thing if you are under a bridge but not OB, you can just play on top of the bridge.


Even better. Still that's one crazy green.
_________________
Hyzer enthusiast
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Rolly
King of Commentary


Joined: 11 Oct 2005
Posts: 9817
Location: South East Division

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 3:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

andros wrote:
kenmlittle wrote:
Why wouldn't you just play directly above the lie? I thought that was the intention of the rule. Same thing if you are under a bridge but not OB, you can just play on top of the bridge.


Even better. Still that's one crazy green.


What rule would you invoke to move it up?

Thats not OB its IB, and its a playable lie,

E. If a large solid obstacle prevents a player from taking a legal stance within 30 centimeters
directly behind the marker disc, the player shall take his or her stance immediately
behind that obstacle on the line of play. The player must comply with all the provisions of
803.04 A other than being within 30 centimeters directly behind the marker disc.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Thumber
LNF Champion


Joined: 08 Nov 2007
Posts: 8271

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 3:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

803.08 Disc Above or Below the Playing Surface

A. If a disc comes to rest above the playing surface in a tree or other object on the course, its lie shall be marked on the playing surface directly below it. If the point directly below the disc above the playing surface is an out-of-bounds area, the disc shall be declared out-of-bounds and marked and penalized in accordance with 803.09. If the playing surface directly below the disc is inside a tree or other solid obstacle, the lie shall be marked on the line of play immediately behind the tree or other solid obstacle. The director may designate a one throw penalty for discs that come to rest two meters or higher above the playing surface. The director may declare the two meter rule to be in effect for the entire course, or just for individual objects.

B. If a disc comes to rest below the playing surface, its lie shall be marked on the playing
surface directly above it. If the point directly above the disc is an out-of-bounds area, the
disc shall be declared out-of-bounds and marked an penalized in accordance with 803.09. If the playing surface directly above the disc is inside a solid obstacle, the lie shall be marked on the line of play immediately behind the solid obstacle.

_________________
meh
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Rolly
King of Commentary


Joined: 11 Oct 2005
Posts: 9817
Location: South East Division

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 3:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

the crack and inside is part of the playing surface unless it is declared that its not. Its in bounds, and you can take a legal throw from there.

Playing surface is not defined (you guys seem, to think that playing surface is what you see if your floating 400 feet above the hole looking down).

Playing surface is each and every spot you can take a legal throw from. You can take a legal throw from down there, moving it from there is just like moving it from anywhere else really.
Another problem is playing surface is not properly defined, and where it is defined refers to 2D surfaces like soccer and ping pong.

I would give someone dangerous lie though, big grin


Last edited by Rolly on Thu Nov 15, 2012 3:28 pm; edited 2 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Rolly
King of Commentary


Joined: 11 Oct 2005
Posts: 9817
Location: South East Division

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 3:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Send it to the PDGA rules people...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
burjwahzeh
Overflow Overlord


Joined: 13 Dec 2005
Posts: 4460
Location: Somewhere where my mind is not.

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 3:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rolly wrote:
the crack and inside is part of the playing surface unless it is declared that its not. Its in bounds, and you can take a legal throw from there.

Playing surface is not defined (you guys seem, to think that playing surface is what you see if your floating 400 feet above the hole looking down).

Playing surface is each and every spot you can take a legal throw from. You can take a legal throw from down there, moving it from there is just like moving it from anywhere else really.
Another problem is playing surface is not properly defined, and where it is defined refers to 2D surfaces like soccer and ping pong.

I would give someone dangerous lie though, big grin

Your definition is a little bit loose, Rolly.
In section 800 of the rules, the megaminds at the PDGA wrote:
Playing Surface: A surface, generally the ground, which is capable of supporting the player and from which a stance may reasonably be taken. In cases where it is unclear whether a surface is the playing surface, the decision shall be made by the tournament director or a course official.

It isn't reasonable to take a stance from inside a fissure or crevace. Whether you can take a legal throw isn't the issue: it's whether a stance may reasonably be taken.

A reasonable stance is not defined in the rules.

SO, to avoid such amiguities, it becomes easy for a TD to say that "the first instance of solid mineral-based material capable of supporting a player which is encountered when passing in a straight line extending from the centre of the earth and extending radially towards outerspacer when said line is travelled from space to the centre of the earth shall be considered the playing surface."

Translation: what you see as the ground from 400'.

Personally, cracks, fissures, and other circus-like features of random silliness constitute poor course design, if only for personal safety reasons. The target location for that particular shot is about as poor a consideration as a course designer could give without even getting into environmental sensitivities and issues of erosion.

"Ah, this is a cool idea."

Really, it isn't.
_________________
Privacy is a means to democracy, not an end in itself. - unknown
Sabotage the system. Provoke more questions! - unknown
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Rolly
King of Commentary


Joined: 11 Oct 2005
Posts: 9817
Location: South East Division

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was looking for that section in the rules where stuff is defined, my searches missed that. Okay ya its unreasonable, but you should not be able to move it up beside the basket
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Rolly
King of Commentary


Joined: 11 Oct 2005
Posts: 9817
Location: South East Division

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 4:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think its unreasonable that a player can expect a reasonable lie in DG big grin
Come on were playing the more adventurous version of golf here. And if you throw it in the crap you should be penalized. It should say "Put your foot behind it and throw", ( Or Take a dangerous lie or casual). The rules make this hole totaly stupid. And in a tourny its a total local hole, throw it in the crack for a 2, boo
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
lissyssil
Champion of Chains


Joined: 28 May 2010
Posts: 2558
Location: Aylmer, QC

PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 5:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apparently, the RC has responded that the disc should be marked on the green, above the crack.
_________________
Go Sens!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
burjwahzeh
Overflow Overlord


Joined: 13 Dec 2005
Posts: 4460
Location: Somewhere where my mind is not.

PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 10:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rolly wrote:
I think its unreasonable that a player can expect a reasonable lie in DG big grin
...

I think it's reprehensible that a player is entitled to a reasonable stance without penalty.

It's handled so subtly in the rule book, but it forms an absolutely defining tenet of the sport.

Disc golf is not about having concern for where your disc ends up. You need not worry about how to make your next shot, because you will always be gifted the chance to make it.

Thanks for pacifying all the babies out there, PDGA. You do a great job homogenizing the player experience by offering such instances of relief. It's comforting to know that players need not develop the skills to keep themselves from having to make a difficult shot. What could be a great sport is yet again mollified by your lack of vision with respect to well reasoned tenets of the game.
_________________
Privacy is a means to democracy, not an end in itself. - unknown
Sabotage the system. Provoke more questions! - unknown
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Rolly
King of Commentary


Joined: 11 Oct 2005
Posts: 9817
Location: South East Division

PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 11:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The pussification of america even has its tenticles in DG. Get down get dirty, stick your foot behind the disc and throw. Yup one might need to be creative, you might get dirty, you might even get a bruise, wanh. Maybee Mom can bring a helmet.

This sport is "easy" enough, it does not need to be so easy " a player is entitled to a reasonable stance without penalty."

You want a reasonable stance, make a reasonable throw.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kenmlittle
Disc Jockey


Joined: 12 Jan 2012
Posts: 725
Location: Toronto, ON

PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 11:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You guys get angry at everything, eh?
_________________
"Friends don't let friends putt like Ken Little."
-Ken Little
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Chuck Shick
Plaid Jacket Champion


Joined: 05 Sep 2000
Posts: 1897
Location: Chelsea

PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 1:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think you may be confusing anger with indignation.
_________________
Cell phones make it easy to communicate with everybody except the people you're currently with.

Will Ferrell
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kenmlittle
Disc Jockey


Joined: 12 Jan 2012
Posts: 725
Location: Toronto, ON

PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 1:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chuck Shick wrote:
I think you may be confusing anger with indignation.


Very True

I think where I struggle is I just read every post from Rolly and burjwahzeh as if CAR GUY WROTE IT!! Then they sound much angrier laughing
_________________
"Friends don't let friends putt like Ken Little."
-Ken Little
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Rolly
King of Commentary


Joined: 11 Oct 2005
Posts: 9817
Location: South East Division

PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 2:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My post was in a laughing voice, because 5 year old girls soccer, by the rules of the game is a tougher sport then DG.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Holly D
Overflow Overlord


Joined: 17 Jul 2010
Posts: 4302
Location: Ottawa

PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 2:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rolly wrote:
My post was in a laughing voice, because 5 year old girls soccer, by the rules of the game is a tougher sport then DG.


To be fair, soccer is second only to mass genocide on the difficulty scale.
_________________
1020 rated lunch preparationist
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    ODGC Forums Forum Index -> Disc Golf Rules & Course Safety All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
RSS Feed for Latest Posts