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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2012 8:18 am    Post subject: Here's a good one - Kid to play Tournie with Turbo Putter Reply with quote

Quote:
justin, my son has a turbo putter and asked me if he can use it the tournement. i heard they were not allowed for tournaments what should i tell him


Deuce is heading to the Sap Bucket X in Vermont this weekend to kick some Montreal a$$. So being the curious one I am, I went to their site to check out the tournie details and see who's coming. 77 players so far. Huge turn out.

Of course, it's all on the Forum so I skip to the last pages and I see the above comment.

This is the Quest Turbo Putter:



This disc was PDGA approved and then had it's approval rescinded (because it's not disc shaped and this sort of cutting into the disc shape would open up the possibilities to boomerang type "discs").

Chuck Kennedy wrote:
It was determined that the Turbo Putt did not actually meet the intent and wording of the pre-Turbo tech specifications that specified a "saucer shape" for approved discs, but was mistakenly approved due to an initially more liberal interpretation of that wording by the specialist doing the measurements. That lead to the PDGA compromise agreement with Quest to continue Turbo-Putt approval for 18 months from that point so they could potentially sell through their Turbo-Putt stock to rec players who might want to continue to use it past PDGA approval expiration Jan 1 of this year. The revised specs published about 6 months after the Turbo-Putt clarified the wording regarding acceptable disc shape and several other dimensions connected with that such as the new 2.6 cm wing maximum for drivers mentioned above.


So we have a kid who is throwing an illegal disc for playing disc golf in competition play and is used to it. And his dad is now asking for permission to continue using it.

Comments so far on the GMDGC Forum:

Quote:
Well its not a pdga event so I would assume it be up to the td, he's a kid I don't see why not.


This is more of a parenting issue, but ignoring that, what do you do?
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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2012 8:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In my morning research I came across this comment too, which I enjoyed:

Quote:
Disc technology has been hammering good courses for years. The first generation of courses were 4,000ish feet for 18 holes. Signature holes were 300'. While folks were throwing lids, it was all good. Once the modern golf disc came into production, those courses were no longer adequate. By 1990 you needed more like 6,000' with a 500' signature hole. As time went on the rims kept getting bigger on the drivers, people kept throwing them farther and farther, and now those 6,000' courses with the 500' shots don't cut it anymore, either. So now we have courses that are 10,000' with 1,000' signature holes. Where does it end? How much public land do we really think is going to be turned into disc golf courses? I like to throw long as much as the next guy, but enough is enough.

The tech standards were far too lax. Course designers need a chance to catch up with how far the discs are flying already. It was time to put an end to the endless "newest-longest-fastest-driver" race that had been going on since 1999. Hopefully capping the rims at 2.6 cm will do that. The Turbo-Putt was just a casualty of something that should provide some protection for a lot of good courses out there. Personally, I'm willing to sacrifice it to achieve that end. It was just a trick disc anyway, destined to the scrap heap of disc history along with the 10 M Brick.

People get caught up in disc technology like it's the heart and soul of the sport. They are just the implements. The courses are far more important than a new "faster-longer" driver. It was long overdue that somebody try to do something that would protect the integrity of the courses we have. The disc manufacturers might not like it, since selling drivers has been as easy as adding 0.1cm to the rim and calling it a speed faster for a decade. They will have to come up with a new trick to sell us a disc. I'd rather deal with that than risk standing on an 8,000' course in five years talking about how it's just not challenging enough anymore.

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Thumber
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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2012 8:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Weird one. I would tell him no. There is no point to continuing to reinforce using illegal equipment. If the TD allows that, what other liberties can the players take? Branch in the way? No problem. Just break it off. This isn't a PDGA tournament anyways.
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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2012 8:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thumber wrote:
Weird one. I would tell him no. There is no point to continuing to reinforce using illegal equipment. If the TD allows that, what other liberties can the players take? Branch in the way? No problem. Just break it off. This isn't a PDGA tournament anyways.


Agreed. The TD shouldn't even have to be forced to make this decision. But what about the comments about it not being a PDGA event? Like you said, what other rules would/could you ignore?

The equipment standards isn't attached to the Rule of Disc Golf. I wonder what the ruling would be for SnapChing.
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Thumber
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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2012 8:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Imagine showing up at a baseball tournament with an illegal corked bat and saying "No no, its cool, this isn't a MLB event"

Or what if the kid liked to putt with a 1000g small hubcap. very solid in the wind....would that be ok?

Or can i bring a boomerang?
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Ken Darcovich
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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2012 8:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jefrey A. Brother wrote:


But what about the comments about it not being a PDGA event? Like you said, what other rules would/could you ignore?



Umm, for example, isn't that the whole point of the OD tour, to be apart from the PDGA and all its inconvenient rules??
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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2012 8:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ken Darcovich wrote:
Jefrey A. Brother wrote:


But what about the comments about it not being a PDGA event? Like you said, what other rules would/could you ignore?



Umm, for example, isn't that the whole point of the OD tour, to be apart from the PDGA and all its inconvenient rules??


What Rules of Disc Golf do they ignore?
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Holly D
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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2012 8:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jefrey A. Brother wrote:
Ken Darcovich wrote:
Jefrey A. Brother wrote:


But what about the comments about it not being a PDGA event? Like you said, what other rules would/could you ignore?



Umm, for example, isn't that the whole point of the OD tour, to be apart from the PDGA and all its inconvenient rules??


What Rules of Disc Golf do they ignore?


Consumables.
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Thumber
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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2012 8:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ken Darcovich wrote:
Jefrey A. Brother wrote:


But what about the comments about it not being a PDGA event? Like you said, what other rules would/could you ignore?



Umm, for example, isn't that the whole point of the OD tour, to be apart from the PDGA and all its inconvenient rules??


Even on the OD tour the PDGA rules are followed. Especially in Am1 and Open. Sure some of the rules of conduct such as beers and puffs are thoroughly ignored, but rules of play are followed

You can't use illegal equipment
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Last edited by Thumber on Fri May 18, 2012 8:48 am; edited 1 time in total
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Roxie
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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2012 8:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Water is not OB. But ya gotta putt from it.
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Holly D
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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2012 8:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jefrey A. Brother wrote:
Ken Darcovich wrote:
Jefrey A. Brother wrote:


But what about the comments about it not being a PDGA event? Like you said, what other rules would/could you ignore?



Umm, for example, isn't that the whole point of the OD tour, to be apart from the PDGA and all its inconvenient rules??


What Rules of Disc Golf do they ignore?


And keeping divisions separate.
Also a little more lax on things like foot faults and hitting your lines.
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Thumber
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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2012 8:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Holly D wrote:
Jefrey A. Brother wrote:
Ken Darcovich wrote:
Jefrey A. Brother wrote:


But what about the comments about it not being a PDGA event? Like you said, what other rules would/could you ignore?



Umm, for example, isn't that the whole point of the OD tour, to be apart from the PDGA and all its inconvenient rules??


What Rules of Disc Golf do they ignore?


And keeping divisions separate.
Also a little more lax on things like foot faults and hitting your lines.


Not in Open at all
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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2012 8:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Holly D wrote:
Jefrey A. Brother wrote:
Ken Darcovich wrote:
Jefrey A. Brother wrote:


But what about the comments about it not being a PDGA event? Like you said, what other rules would/could you ignore?



Umm, for example, isn't that the whole point of the OD tour, to be apart from the PDGA and all its inconvenient rules??


What Rules of Disc Golf do they ignore?


Consumables.


That's from the Competition Manual. Most outside PDGA tournies ignore most of these rules (for example, dress code).
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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2012 8:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Roxie wrote:
Water is not OB. But ya gotta putt from it.


Water isn't OB in the PDGA rules.
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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2012 8:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Would the OD Tour have issues with the Turbo Putter? Is there an rebel tour trend out there that could sustain Quest and their quest in illegal PDGA discs?
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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2012 8:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jefrey A. Brother wrote:
Would the OD Tour have issues with the Turbo Putter? Is there an rebel tour trend out there that could sustain Quest and their quest in illegal PDGA discs?


I would call someone out on it. We are out there trying to win money and if someone is using an illegal disc to do so, someone is going to call them out
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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2012 8:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thumber wrote:
Holly D wrote:
Jefrey A. Brother wrote:
Ken Darcovich wrote:
Jefrey A. Brother wrote:


But what about the comments about it not being a PDGA event? Like you said, what other rules would/could you ignore?



Umm, for example, isn't that the whole point of the OD tour, to be apart from the PDGA and all its inconvenient rules??


What Rules of Disc Golf do they ignore?


And keeping divisions separate.
Also a little more lax on things like foot faults and hitting your lines.


Not in Open at all


Yeah, I was going to add "depending on the division", but I couldn't really speak to Open.
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Holly D
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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2012 9:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jefrey A. Brother wrote:
Holly D wrote:
Jefrey A. Brother wrote:
Ken Darcovich wrote:
Jefrey A. Brother wrote:


But what about the comments about it not being a PDGA event? Like you said, what other rules would/could you ignore?



Umm, for example, isn't that the whole point of the OD tour, to be apart from the PDGA and all its inconvenient rules??


What Rules of Disc Golf do they ignore?


Consumables.


That's from the Competition Manual. Most outside PDGA tournies ignore most of these rules (for example, dress code).


I think it's probably more the Competition Manual that they are trying to circumvent, rather than the rules themselves.
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Thumber
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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2012 9:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Back to the main point though, there is a huge difference between turning a blind eye to a pint or two on the course and condoning a player using illegal equipment.

Plus, like BBP said, the parent should never have put this on the TD. What kind of lesson is he trying to teach his kid?
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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2012 9:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thumber wrote:
Back to the main point though, there is a huge difference between turning a blind eye to a pint or two on the course and condoning a player using illegal equipment.

Plus, like BBP said, the parent should never have put this on the TD. What kind of lesson is he trying to teach his kid?


I believe the lesson is that if you bitch enough, the world will surely recognize what a truly golden special snowflake you really are.
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