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Thumber
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2011 11:49 am    Post subject: Moving branches Reply with quote

Apparently the rules in terms of moving loose debris has changed. At the Island I was informed you could now move sticks etc that were in front of your lie. I had a big dead branch that extended both in front and behind the lie and my card told me to go ahead and move it as the rules had been changed to allow this.
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andros
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2011 11:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

PDGA wrote:
Summary of Rules Changes

Definitions of the basket and its components have been added to the Glossary so that we no longer have to use the phrase "entrapment section".

The definition of holing out has been tightened up a bit. A putt that sticks in the side of the tray, or hangs outside the tray from one of the nubs, no longer counts.

The hole has been completed once the disc has come to rest, not when the disc is removed.

The "unplayable lie" rule has been reformulated into an "optional rethrow" rule. It is now clear that penalty strokes are not added if the rethrow option is taken, so that double jeopardy is avoided.

The rules for a lie above ground have been changed to include a lie below ground (in a crevice or below a bridge, for example).

The relief rules have been simplified. You can't move anything unless it's in your stance. If something is both in your stance and between your lie and the hole, you can move it. You can always ask people to move themselves or their stuff if they are in your way.

The 5-meter relief rule has been extended to anywhere back along the line of play, and moved to the relief section.

A director may designate a drop zone to be used for lost disc on a hole.

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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2011 11:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Summary of Rules Changes

Definitions of the basket and its components have been added to the Glossary so that we no longer have to use the phrase "entrapment section".

The definition of holing out has been tightened up a bit. A putt that sticks in the side of the tray, or hangs outside the tray from one of the nubs, no longer counts.

The hole has been completed once the disc has come to rest, not when the disc is removed.

The "unplayable lie" rule has been reformulated into an "optional rethrow" rule. It is now clear that penalty strokes are not added if the rethrow option is taken, so that double jeopardy is avoided.

The rules for a lie above ground have been changed to include a lie below ground (in a crevice or below a bridge, for example).

The relief rules have been simplified. You can't move anything unless it's in your stance. If something is both in your stance and between your lie and the hole, you can move it. You can always ask people to move themselves or their stuff if they are in your way.

The 5-meter relief rule has been extended to anywhere back along the line of play, and moved to the relief section.

A director may designate a drop zone to be used for lost disc on a hole.



The Rule:

803.05 Obstacles and Relief

A. Obstacles to a Stance or Throwing Motion: With the exception of casual obstacles to a stance as described in 803.05 B, a player is not allowed to move any obstacle on the course. No relief is granted from park equipment (such as signs, trash cans, picnic tables, etc), which is considered part of the course. A player is allowed to request that other people remove themselves and/or their belongings from the player's stance or line of play. A player must choose the stance which results in the least movement of any obstacle. Once a legal stance is taken, the player may not move an obstacle in any way in order to make room for a throwing motion. It is legal for a player's throwing motion to cause incidental movement of an obstacle.

B. Casual Obstacles to a Stance: A player may obtain relief only from the following obstacles that are in the stance or run-up area: casual water, loose leaves or debris, broken branches no longer connected to a tree, motor vehicles, harmful insects or animals, players' equipment, people, or any item or area specifically designated by the director before the round. The player must first attempt to remove the obstacle. If it is impractical to move the obstacle, the player's lie may be relocated to the nearest lie which is no closer to the hole, is on the line of play, and is not more than five meters from the original lie, as agreed to by a majority of the group or an official (unless greater casual relief is announced by the director).

C. Optional Relief: A player may declare that he or she is taking optional relief. The lie may then be relocated to a new lie that is no closer to the hole, and on the line of play. The original throw plus one penalty throw are counted in the player's score.

D. In situations where it is unclear if an object may be moved or other relief obtained, it shall be determined by a majority of the group or an official.

E. A player shall receive one penalty throw, without a warning, for violation of an obstacle or relief rule.

F. A player who purposely damages anything on the course shall receive two penalty throws, without a warning, if observed by two or more players of the group or an official. The player may also be disqualified from the tournament, in accordance with Section 3.3 of the Competition Manual.
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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2011 11:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is there ambiguity in B and C?
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Thumber
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2011 12:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jefrey A. Brother wrote:
Is there ambiguity in B and C?


Does the TD have to state is there is casual water on the course or can the player decide for themselves?

also, do they need card mate agreement? This is actually pretty important to establish
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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2011 12:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Casual Water: Bodies of water other than those that have been specifically designated by the director prior to the start of the round as out-of-bounds or those that have been specifically designated by the director prior to the start of the round as not being casual water.

So, any puddles would be casual water. Mike has, in the past, made the creek on 18 casual.

I don't know about the card mate agreement though.
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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2011 12:12 pm    Post subject: Re: Moving branches Reply with quote

Thumber wrote:
I had a big dead branch that extended both in front and behind the lie and my card told me to go ahead and move it as the rules had been changed to allow this.


Was it in your stance? Funny the PDGA doesn't define "stance".
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Thumber
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2011 12:16 pm    Post subject: Re: Moving branches Reply with quote

Jefrey A. Brother wrote:
Thumber wrote:
I had a big dead branch that extended both in front and behind the lie and my card told me to go ahead and move it as the rules had been changed to allow this.


Was it in your stance? Funny the PDGA doesn't define "stance".


Ran right over the edge of my marker and right through my legs. The thing is, I likely could have taken a different stance (left foot back looking backwards twisting stance) but I didn't have to so I took the option and moved the branch
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Jefrey A. Brother
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2011 12:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wonder what would happen if you decided you wanted to putt straddle, and the branch ran under your non-supporting-point-in-line-of-play, and in front of your lie, so you moved it. But then decided to putt regular instead.
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